Jodie Morgan 0:00 I think a real leader is someone who can inspire others by what is phrased as the multiplier effect. And the multiplier effect is quite simply, how do you get 120 150% from every individual in your organization. And the only way to be able to do that is you have to get each individual to understand how they can make a positive change, how they can be influential, how they can meet their own dreams and desires. And if you do that, and if you touch each individual in that way, then you don't get 50% or 80% of who that person is. But you get 150% kevin edwards 0:40 you are listening to the real leaders podcast where today impacts tomorrow. The multiplier effect creates change. And leaders keep it real. I'm your host, Kevin Edwards, and that excerpt was from Jody Morgan, the CEO of green mantra, who shares insights on the plastic crisis, advanced recycling solutions in the leadership needed to sustain the recycling industry. So without further ado, ladies and gentlemen, let's give it up for the real Jody Morgan. Enjoy 5432 and one and welcome, everyone to this episode of the real leaders podcast. I'm your host, Kevin Edwards. Joining us today is the CEO green mancia. Miss Jody Morgan. Jody, thanks for being with us today. Jodie Morgan 1:29 Thanks for having me. kevin edwards 1:31 You got it. Well, so Jody green mancia place on the realist impact awards 100, top impact company as of 2020. And our audience wants to know, how does this story go? Jodie Morgan 1:42 So first of all, I'm really honored that we received the award. We've been fortunate to receive a few awards for both our growth rate, as well as being an innovative company. And maybe that's the first place to start. So green mantra started about 10 years ago. We were literally in a closet. We called it a lab, but it wasn't allowed into the closet. And there was some technology that was brought over to Canada from India, around a catalyst. And a catalyst is basically something that creates a reaction. And at first, like many startups, didn't really know what we wanted to do with this particular catalyst. But over time, we determined that this particular catalyst could strategic write down plastic, so plastic that's already been used waste plastic and turn it into really valuable products. And over the last two years, as a result of that discovery, we've been building out our facility and we're now commercial, we sell in a number of different continents and to a number of different applications. And for me today, it's about continuing to demonstrate to people that you can build a great business that does something good for the world. That can be a catalyst for sustainable impact. kevin edwards 3:04 Amazing. So in this in this closet in this shed now describe to me, what were you working with petri dishes? What is that as an enzyme reaction? What were you working on? And what was the intention behind this catalyst. Jodie Morgan 3:19 So the intention, once they determined that this and I started in 2017, so I wasn't there in the closet with them. But it was really to determine whether or not this catalyst could be used to help to fight the issues that we have with the overabundance of plastic. And you know, at Green Mantra we believe that plastic has a really important place. It is what gives us fuel efficiency. It's what preserves our food. But at the same time, we have to have something that we can do with this plastic after it's been used. The reason it's so effective is because it never breaks down. But the problem is also that it never breaks down. So was a matter of determining whether this catalyst could be part of that solution. And what was determined pretty early on is that it could be. And then it was a matter of really building out that technology and getting it to scale. It's one thing to do it in a small petri dish in a closet. It's another thing to build an entire manufacturing facility that can do this at scale. And that's really been the path that the business has been on is proving that this technology works, and now scaling it, so become global business. kevin edwards 4:32 So, Jody, maybe help explain to our audience how this process works. When I am a consumer and I use a plastic bin that was contains my turkey meat for my sandwich, and I throw it in a recycling bin. How does it end up in green mantra and what does this plastic what happens this plastic after it leaves green mantra? Jodie Morgan 4:57 Sure. I'm actually gonna start with the last first, if I may, so a lot of people because we use post use plastic as our feedstock, they assume that we're going to turn it back into something that can be used to make lawn furniture or your planter pot. We're not actually the primary ingredient, the way that we describe ourselves as we're more like yeast. So if you put yeast a very, very small amount of a product into dough, you get bread, not a cracker. So our product at a really small percentage dramatically changed changes our customers products. Okay, so that's the first thing that I think is important. So we're considered to be a category of products called additives and additives, small percentage, dramatic effect. The way that we get our raw material is we typically work with outlets where there's not a natural home. So film as an example, the film that goes over your food and the film that's used for your packaging. It's really hard. For your typical reprocessing centers, they handle that film. It just doesn't go through their process well, doesn't sort well, but it's a perfect raw material for green mantra, because that film is made up of molecules. And those molecules are exactly what I want to use in my process. So we bring in these raw materials, we put them through a process we melted down. And we have a catalyst that breaks down these long molecules. So plastic starts with individual monomers. So think about one Lego. And then when it's formed, you put all these Legos together in a big stock. That's plastic. We take that big stack and our catalyst comes along like a Lego guy with scissors and just cuts it at a different way. And as they do that, it creates this whole new world of products that are our, the yeast like, effect for our customers. kevin edwards 6:59 Right. Okay. So that makes sense. So green mantra has found this solution and now a big problem in Plastic right Now it's like the purity, right? So there's like seven different types of plastics milk jugs, don't go with yogurt jugs or cans, whatever you call them. So right so this is this is a big problem. So now this additive this yeast I like that metaphor, this yeast like product can work with the film's can work with these different products, to to basically, now do you supply like this additive to these plastic processing centers so that they can have an easier process and make sure that all the plastic that's being recycled is actually being recycled? Is that kind of a Jodie Morgan 7:44 So then we don't necessarily go back into plastic. So some of the applications that our products are used in are things like roofing, and it's used in roads. It's used in wood plastic composites. But we are also used back in plastic. So a lot of companies as you know, consumer companies, Unilever, Colgate, etc, have made pledges about they're going to incorporate more post use plastic back into their packaging. But when you take something that's irregular, like post use plastic and try to put it through a equipment that needs to run really, really quickly. So for example, when you buy your detergent, you're not buying the detergent for the bottle that it's in, but the brand still wants that bottle to look perfect. And in order to do that they've got very sophisticated equipment that can run lots and lots of bottles that are all exactly the same, right? So the cap can screw on perfectly. It'll it has strength, so if you drop it, it's okay, the bottom is flat. These bottles have to be perfect, but when you put something irregular in it, like post use plastic, which they've all said they're going to do, then all of a sudden your equipment doesn't run well. If you put just a small percentage of our product into that formulation, it will make the virgin plastic, the pure plastic work perfectly well with the post use plastic and all of a sudden, you can get a detergent bottle that is exactly the same and form and function as the one that was made with all brand new plastic. kevin edwards 9:22 Okay, got it. So, okay, great. So again that the yeast concept makes a lot more sense now. So I can I can mix you know, different types of grains together and your use product was still going to give me bread. So, okay, so God so when we're thinking you just mentioned like the Unilever's, the organizations who have taken this pledge, basically saying that they are going to pay a what was the word? Yeah, voluntary contribution, or voluntary payable on these virgin plastics. So this is an efforts to grow a plastic supply chain and basically Britain you use plastic as a commodity. So lower the price of recycled plastics. How is this impacting your business? And what leadership is needed amongst other organizations that use single use plastics to continue to reduce the price of virgin plastic and thus reduce plastic waste? Jodie Morgan 10:20 Interesting question. So specifically for green mantra, we don't have an issue with the ability to either to bring in plastic as a raw material and we pay for all of our plastic. And part of the reason we're able to do that is because of the low processing costs and the way that we position our product in the market. That being said, a lot of the consumer brands as they're trying to incorporate more post use plastic into their formulations, there's actually a supply issue. And there's a supply issue because we're simply not collecting and properly sorting the plastic that we're using. So until that part of the infrastructure solved, it does create an issue for these brands to be able to meet their pledge, because they will eventually have a problem getting enough plastic. So once I figured out the formulation side, now I have to have enough plastic that I can put it into all my detergent bottles. So there is some infrastructure that needs to be built out. There's a consumer part of this, which is just awareness of what can be recycled. And where do I put it if I want it to be recycled? There's issues around the sorting equipment. So once we get it to the recycle center, how do we make sure that everything goes into its own correct slot. If you look at your soda bottle as an example, your soda bottle can have three different types of plastic, the P t for the bottle, and the label can be a separate type of plastic and then the lid can also be a third type of plastic. So the sorting equipment is super, super important. And so there's a lot that still needs to be done on the collection. Consumers The sorting equipment to make sure that the supply is there as people are trying to meet these magnificent pledges that they've made. I don't care answer Yeah, kevin edwards 12:10 no, definitely no, definitely. It's interesting because the the plastic crisis is so robust. Like you said, the sorting issue for me, if I have a beer can and I throw it in the trash, that's a big problem. Or if I have a styrofoam and I put it in there, it's going to just create more effort and more time from these recycling plants to do something like that. So how upstream is this problem then? Jody, is it is it where the consumers, the consumers? I guess it's the suppliers there who are making the single use products or is it the consumer that is having trouble filtering it? Is it the labeling Where have you seen this problem be such an issue upstream? Jodie Morgan 12:55 You know, it's interesting when Unknown Speaker 12:58 when I started with three months We didn't use our own waste as our own raw material. And it was interesting when you had chats with the people that have been here for a while about why didn't wait, you know, if we if we had a soda bottle and the lid was probably propylene, which is one of our feedstocks, Why wasn't I putting that in event that we could use, and even at a company like rematch or where our world revolves around plastic, and most of the people are scientists that work here, and there's still a lack of awareness of what is polypropylene? What is polyethylene, what's polystyrene, and then it can look very much the same from one application, whether it's a yogurt container or whether it's milk jug. So if we have a problem when this is our world, I can only imagine what it's like for the normal consumer to be able to try to abide by the guidelines of what I should put where the second issue Is it depends where you are, right? So if you're in San Francisco, there's a much more robust collection system. And therefore what you can put into the bins in San Francisco is very different than what you would put into the bins here in Toronto. So it's not consistent from place to place. So the education is a real issue, interesting concept or issue to be tackled, because it's not the same from place to place and it's really difficult for consumers to be able to determine what is this product made from? kevin edwards 14:36 okay. Yeah. And in this problem with being sorry, bus you just mentioned, the chemical use was a catalyst in this. A lot of people feared that the recycling because of China, not accepting all the recyclables right now. That's a $200 billion dollar industry is pushed back on to the United States and to Canada into this country that we're shipping plastic go Now they have to go to places close by to you in the southeast, which is a big infrastructure down there. There seems to be some fear that it's not big enough. But being a catalyst in this space, do you think that the problem can be solved that we can eliminate this plastic waste and and be a world that uses plastic as a commodity? Or do you think single use is the issue and that companies should stop making plastic and ban it entirely? Jodie Morgan 15:31 So I don't think it should be banned. I think if we think about it, you know, you go onto an airplane and you have a plastic cup. And someone might say, Well, why don't they use glass? Well, the weight of the glass will generate more of a carbon footprint than the plastic. The issue is not the plastic The issue is what do we do with the plastic when we're done with the plastic and making sure that it's getting to the right place? so that it can be sorted and reused. There's a whole group of companies that are forming. And green mantra sure is one of them called Advanced recycling. So we've always had the mechanical recycling, which is, you know, your blue bin that gets picked up at your house and somebody takes it to a sorting center and they sort it. There's another whole group of companies that are starting to look at plastic because it's a super interesting molecule, and the different things that we can do with that on a molecular level. And these really do fit together, the mechanical resorting handling portion of the plastic waste, and the chemical recyclers like green mantra, handling another portion of the waste. So, for me, I don't think it's a matter of banning plastic. I think it's a matter of being more responsible with how we use it, and also being way more responsible with what we do at the end of life. And there's lots of different ideas. I'm sure you and the viewers have heard tons of them. I mean, you could in the past, what did we do when we want to cans to be recycled? bottles to be recycled. We said it was a five cent, you know, deposit and systems like that work well. In other countries, there's taxes and that cover a portion of the recycling costs. So there's lots of different things that can be done. I don't think it's one answer. But your basic question was, do I think that it can be solved? And I absolutely do. I mean, I'm a bit of an optimist, and I'm an entrepreneur, so that would be my normal answer. But I really do think it's a solvable problem. And I think that the awareness today is so great, that great minds thinking together can obviously solve just about any problem there is. kevin edwards 17:35 no Do you think this awareness has attributed to new employees coming to the company new brains new focuses new inspirations and passions from your employees within your own company? Jodie Morgan 17:47 Um, do I think that it's changed within green mantra? kevin edwards 17:50 Yes, or externally as well just like around the hype of plastic and Jodie Morgan 17:55 there's no question and when I you know, two years ago, three years ago When I was first coming in contact with green matcha, there was talk about it, but it has, you know, the discussions are exponential compared to where they were two to three years ago. And start part of it, obviously, is the really impactful photos that you see the turtle with a straw on his nose and things like that. But once you've seen some of those things, you can't unsee them, and then you start to see plastic everywhere. You know, you can be out on a walk with your dog in the woods and you'll see that someone left the bottle and you just become so much more aware. So I think it's gaining momentum, and I don't think that people can unsee what they now kevin edwards 18:48 Jody, one of your first answers about why you're excited to be on the list is you said you know, we can be an organization that can be profitable, but also take on some of the world's largest challenges. What would you consider a business like this? You mentioned responsibility being one of these things, you consider yourself a sustainable company, a responsible company, how would you describe your organization. Jodie Morgan 19:11 And there's definitely two sides to it. So if I'm speaking to a lot of my my investors, my board my shareholders, we're a business that's doing good for the world. But what they've invested in truly is they want to invest in something that does good for the world. But also they've decided to put their money behind it. And they do want a return on that investment within the company. There's a whole bunch of us that are really trying to do something good and impactful with our heartbeats. So I'm a bit of a carrot cruncher myself, I think it's important that we do the right thing. I think it's important that we leave the world in a better place than we found it. But there's a convergence between those two things. Now, if you If you appreciate the concept of tithing, you know, we're supposed to give 10% of our money to do something good. I don't want 10% of people's money to be invested in these types of companies, I want it to be their 90% investment. And the only way that I can get that so that I can multiply the impact that green mantra has not just as green mantra, but as other companies like green mantra is we have to have amazing, we have to be able to return a significant profit. Why? Because then I don't get 10% of somebody's investment, I get 90% of their investment, they want to do this, it feels good. And they make good returns. And that combination is what creates this ripple effect that gives Green Monster the ability to have much much more of an impact on this global problem than just our small company. kevin edwards 20:50 So as you receive more profit, you receive more capital, you're able to scale and basically take on more, more classic problems. What's What's, what's the vision going forward with this when you when you start to receive a lot of investment in capital, Jodie Morgan 21:06 so there's two sides to it. So the first thing that I don't want to miss is it's not just about green mantra. I mean, we believe, you know, there, I don't get to get this expression wrong, but the rising tide floats all ships or something. So the better the green mantra does, as an organization. viewed from an investment criteria, the better this part of the industry will do. And that's really important to us to try to be as much as we can successful in part to be the poster child for this space. But then on the second side for us, we've got a plant in that's just west of Toronto. We're installing our fourth line production line, and we're in the process of scoping out our fifth line. So we've been commercial since 2016. And we've just started to penetrate the European market in a big way. As opposed to just in the last couple of years. We've just been in North America. So globally, we're expanding. And in addition to that, we're going into more and more different types of applications. So this really is a platform for a global business that will have manufacturing in various areas. And in addition to that be able to service a wide variety of different types of customers and applications. kevin edwards 22:23 Amazing. Well, I really like that, quote, The rising tide floats all ships. That's completely true for got it right. I think, Well, it sounds right to me. Yeah. floats all ships. Of course, the better you do, the better everyone else does. Now, Jodi, you're getting blown up right here. You're getting a lot of text messages coming through. How do you balance something like a CEO type position in your normal, everyday life? Jodie Morgan 22:51 It's an interesting question. I guess I'd start with the fact that I love business and I love all types of business. So for me, this isn't it's not a job, it's what I like to do. It's what I like to spend my time on. And I fell in love with the mantra when I was on the board, which I did for a year. And what I loved about it was not just the elegant chemistry and the fact that we've got to do good. But in a green mantra, if you look at the employee base, we have people that work here that are from 12 different countries. And we're a pretty small company, right? So 12 different countries. And it's not that their parents came from 12 different countries, it's they did, so the amount of diversity and the amount of energy that you get with that type of organization. And that employment base is fantastic. So every day you get to come in, and you get to be with people that you actually want to spend time with. So for me, I can't say that I have great work life balance, but I can say that the time that I spend here, I really enjoy it and I never regret a minute of it. kevin edwards 23:59 So This, I guess, is that DNI diversity inclusion? Or is this just a business strategy that you happen to have a lot of transplants come in, they want to work for the company, and they all share some, you know, some some similar interests. Jodie Morgan 24:14 I think it's probably both, um, we tend to have I mean, I'm obviously pretty old. I've been doing this for 35 years, but most of the workforce is significantly younger than I am. And I think it's so there's a bit of it. That's a generational thing. People are attracted to working for companies that have an impact, a positive impact. Canada is particularly American, but Canada is particularly fantastic about bringing in a diversity of people from all over the world. So I think that that is is certainly helpful. But I think that once you start that and you have an organization that's diverse, it's way easier to recruit more and more people that come from different backgrounds because they want to be a part of that. So I didn't start it, but I certainly try to foster it. kevin edwards 24:59 How do you think Your employees, these people would describe your leadership style? Jodie Morgan 25:06 That is a great question. I would hope that I think I'd have to say it differently, I'd have to say this is what I hope that they would say because it is what I try to do. I've had a really amazing career, I've gotten to do a ton of things that have been really, really fun. And at this stage, I really just want to try to be an inspiration to other people, to also live their dreams. And in order to do that, I think the best style of leadership is being a servant leader. How can I help you remove obstacles so that you can be more successful? How can I spend time getting to know what's really important to you, your family, etc, so that I can make sure that you have that work life balance? How can I make you feel that every day that you spend here and all the time that you invest is a really worthwhile investment Have your time, energy and talents. And and if I can do that, and people are inspired by that, and I will have been successful. kevin edwards 26:09 Jody, you said the rising tide floats all ships. I'm just gonna stick with that quote today because I like it so much. You've also mentioned Unilever, your own leadership style, what type of leadership is needed amongst the recycling industry to float all ships and sustain this wave? Jodie Morgan 26:28 I think that there's a lot of things actually that are going on will really help. So one is simply this idea that we can all help each other. So it used to be that people were concerned that chemical recycling or advanced recycling would be competitive to mechanical recycling. And I think we've gotten through that. I also think that there are a lot of solutions out there and trying to help put the solutions providers together with the people that are searching for solutions is really important and there's been a couple of conversations around How do we create that type of database? How do we create that type of network? And the leadership for that often comes from outside, right? It's a non traditional problem for the sector. So you go to companies that are actually Big Data companies, as opposed to people that you would think would be in this space, like the plastic manufacturers, or the manufacturers of the bottle. So how do we reach across this continuum to find the solutions that have already been created in other industries and other markets and have addressed other problems and bring them in to better understand and find solutions in this space? So I think it's a combination. I think it's accepting the fact that this problem is big enough that no one has to worry about competing with each other. And many of the things that we're facing have already been solved in other places. We just have to look for those solutions and bring those people or companies in to help us to address the problems that we're Having in plastic. kevin edwards 28:01 I like that answer a lot. Yeah, breaking down those silos. And that's what leaders do. They're building a bridge, they're starting those discussions and building those connections. So JT to bring this full circle, I just want to ask you, What is your definition of a real leader? Jodie Morgan 28:17 I think every leader is someone who can inspire others by what is framed as the multiplier effect. And the multiplier effect is quite simply, how do you get 120 150% from every individual in your organization, and the only way to be able to do that is you have to get each individual to understand how they can make positive change how they can be influential, how they can meet their own dreams and desires. And and if you do that, and if you touch each individual in that way, then you don't get 50% or 80% of who that person is, but you get 150%. And I think that's what real leaders do. I think To find individuals in their organization to be better than they ever thought they can be. kevin edwards 29:06 Beautifully put God in a catalyst. Jodie Morgan 29:12 going right back to the beginning of kevin edwards 29:13 the session. Well, I hope the audience out there enjoys this interview as much as I did today, Jody, I appreciate your time coming on the religious podcast today. For Jodi Morgan. I'm Kevin, we're just asking you to go out there, inspire others, and always folks, keep it real. Thanks, Jody. Jodie Morgan 29:29 Thank you. kevin edwards 29:33 All right. And thank you everyone who made this far in the episode of the real leaders podcast with Jody Morgan. If you enjoyed this episode, folks, and want to listen to more leaders read about more leaders. You can go online to real dash leaders comm slash subscribe and use coupon code podcast 25 to receive your first magazine for free. So just to make this clear, I'm not sure trying to fool you guys we do four magazines a year. If you use coupon code podcast 25 you will get one out of those four for free. He gets about this usually 72 so that's $54 you are going to pay for an entire year for a long time. Long time people good people, you can do real dash leaders calm slash subscribe. You just can't find any of the leadership stories like this out there market. You can think you can but you really can't. Anyway, subscriber or not of the magazine. We appreciate you listening to this episode. Make sure you are subscribed to this podcast it is free and if you haven't told your friends about it already, be leader and do so we need that multiplier effect, folks, we we need more people to latch on to leadership. All right, thanks again and stay tuned for the next episode, my friends Transcribed by https://otter.ai